All posts in the topic Further erosion of postal service (Short link)
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- There are 29 posts — by 10 authors — in this topic.
- Latest post made by Roz Smith at Jun 09 15:59 UTC
On Monday (21 April 2008) the last collection from the pillar box outside
Headington Post Office was changed from 7pm to 6pm. Royal Mail claim that the
reason they have stopped late collections from this and other post boxes in
Oxford is "in order to provide our customers with the best possible service".
The Royal Mail is struggling to survive at all.
The basic fault is the policy of the EU, which has stripped away its profitable
side and left it with inadequate income and disaffected staff.
If you read the somewhat lengthy message I posted on the Oxford Central South
and West forum, it details the reasons behind this and the direct EU
responsibility for PO closures.
Even the loss of our sorting-office in Headington must be blamed on the EU, as
the Royal Mail had to make cuts somewhere just in order to keep on functioning.
That is what they mean by the "best possible". Not the best possible if we left
the EU, but the best possible under the present circumstances of foreign
dictatorship.
We seem to be holding a sort of hypocrisy Olympics under the name of a local
government election.
The Conservative leaflet "Fresh Start" echoes the Libdems in pretending to be
opposed to Post Office closures and cuts in service. They avoid admitting that
the closures have been imposed by the EU, into which the Conservatives took
us. They continue to support membership despite having to surrender our
national sovereignty. Of course they have their fat cats up there getting
lavish lifestyles.
The Conservatives also claim they are "campaigning to protect our local pubs".
How? The major factor in reduced pub turnover is the smoking ban, which again
issues directly from the EU. When I was in France and Spain I noticed that bars
and cafés there have a choice as to whether or not to permit smoking, and most
of them still do - unless a customer in there at the time objects. Here
publicans are being subjected to massive fines - £5,000+ - which are surely out
of all proportion.
Not one of the election leaflets put through my door admits that fortnightly
refuse collection is, likewise, a result of the massive EU fines for landfill.
Julia, I have read your post on Central, South and Western about Post
Office closures, and I have to say that even for me, as a euro-
skeptic Lib Dem (a rare breed indeed) I find it all very overblown.
That Europe wants a postal and delivery network open to competition
is not a sign of further erosion, it is key to the idea of the Common
Market even you would acknowledge we joined. Why should postal
services be a protected monopoly when no other of the main means of
communication - telephone and electronic - are.
If you live on Lewis you must accept that communication with the rest
of the world, by car, by post, by phone, by internet is going to be
that little bit less convenient and quite probably more expensive
than in urban UK.
Also, Post Office closures are little if anything to do with this
open competition policy. They're due to a lack of innovation by the
Post Office itself. They could, for example, rather than themselves
remaining a Royal Mail monopoly network of offices, have allowed sub-
postmasters to innovate - imagine an office service where all the
competing delivery networks could pick up and deliver to for example,
alongside other things like more money transfer facilities and so
on. Indeed, Lib Dem Post Office policy is just that - to demerge
Royal Mail and the Post Office and allow the Post Office to
innovate. Post Office Counters Ltd could then become a comprehensive
network of multi-service delivery and collection agents - an access
point into the newly emerging commercial scene for everyone.
Now, I happen to think that the delivery network, like the internet,
is going to be a crucial vehicle for ensuring a level playing field
in access to new ways of doing business, but the way to achieve that
is to be ruthless in eradicating monopolies and cartels rather than
in protecting a declining mechanism of communication.
My euro-skepticism centers around whether the UK can be a more
completely free-trade liberal country inside or outside of Europe.
At the moment that question remains in the balance, though with the
accession of more economically liberal new countries there is greater
hope that Europe can become genuinely free-trade rather than being
dominated by what seems the older, more protectionist original EEC
crowd. But to me, wanting out of Europe to retreat into some
protectionist nightmare would be the worst of all worlds.
Post Office closures, whether under the previous Tory government or
this one, are a clear failure of UK governments to adapt to a
competitive, globalized world. And protectionism breeds poverty.
Well Jock, what you are saying is an exercise in denial.
To claim that "Post Office closures are little if anything to do with this open
competition policy. They're due to a lack of innovation by the Post Office
itself" is simply not in accordance with the facts.
Plainly, Post Office closures ARE the result of EU policy and have been
enforced and imposed by the EU commissioners.
The hypocrisy of Libdem, Labour and Conservative campaigners in denying it is
not a very pretty picture.
You are using emotive terms like "protectionist nightmare" to simply avoid
looking at the facts.
There is not the slightest reason why someone living in Lewis should have to
pay more for delivery under a national system. It was not a protectionist
nightmare - it was a good, sound system that worked very well for 150 years
until the EU messed it up.
The Post Office could not fight this situation by introducing "innovations",
and if the EU policy of so-called free competition is so much better and so
much fairer, how do you explain the fact that neither Germany nor Holland have
opened up their postal deliveries to foreign competition? Can you name any
other EU country that has done so?
Of course not! They are simply milking Britain and helping themselves to our
assets. It has got nothing to do with the old political jargon of right
wing/left wing. You need to adapt to a new political scenario.
I don’t think we are currently destined to lose any post offices in Headington and Marston, are we? So anyone concerned with the loss of post offices elsewhere in the country might make more of an impact by going to the Post Office Closures National Action Group at http://www.postofficeclosures.org.uk/ and contributing to their forum (second link down on the left). That’s not to say we don’t have a lot to complain about with our *local* postal services. The inaccessibility of the sorting office when you have to go to collect mail annoys most people, but is particularly difficult for those who don’t have a car, as there is no direct bus service from Headington to Littlemore. And a word of warning: if you miss the delivery of a parcel on a Saturday, don’t attempt to collect it until Tuesday morning (*three* days later), even though the standard card says that items will be available for collection 24 hours after the delivery attempt. I cycled over to Ledgers Close at 8.30am one Monday to collect a Saturday package, but was told that the 24-hour rule doesn’t apply at the weekend. And when I asked where my parcel physically was, they said it had been safely locked up in Headington Post Office all weekend and would be brought back to Ledgers Close during the course of Monday morning! I refused to pay a 50p fee so that it could be brought from Headington Post Office to Ledgers Close and then sent back to Headington Post Office for me to collect, as I reckon the fewer journeys a parcel makes, the less chance there is of it getting lost. (I am not sure if this also applies to Marston: do you have to collect your parcels from Littlemore as well?)
At least the opening hours at Littlemore are longer again - it was a nightmare
for the time it was effectively only half a day. One occasion, I had to make 5
trips, before my undelivered parcel was finally found, after falling foul of
timing, as Stephanie mentions.
As a comparison, I asked some friends in the US (frequently seen as the epitome
of devil-take-the-hindmost competitive capitalism) how the US Postal Service is
doing. They live, variously, in the middle of Chicago, a modest-sized town and
a small place so remote that it is 9 hours drive (no rail) from the nearest
international airport:
******
Very well, actually.
They survive on a combination of two things -- advertisement mail and
staggering efficiency. You'd think, listening to the news, that the USPS was a
complete joke, but the USPS is *very* good -- at least 99.9999% of all letters
are delivered in under three days and delivered correctly.
The Post Office is required to operate in the black, so we're seeing somewhat
frequent postage increases, but still, I can mail a letter to anybody in the
country for $.42 -- an amazingly cheap price compared to almost anywhere else
in the world. And despite that low cost, they still make a profit.
The USPS does do a little bit of extra government work -- in particular, that's
where you go to submit passport applications -- but in general, they move mail
and parcels, and they do it very well, given the scale they operate on.
FedEx and the like have hurt them, but really, they compete on different scales
The central Headington PO has been twice threatened with closure and just
because it is not on the present list does not mean it won't be next time.
Royal Mail and Post Office Ltd are two different things, so comparison between
Royal Mail and the US postal delivery service is completely misleading.
How can it prove that people here are better off for having to lose 2,500 local
Post Offices?
One possible thing we could do to try to prop up our Post Offices is to buy
their telephone and internet services. It's probably too little too late, but
it may help.
I deeply sympathize with Stephanie's problems vis-a-vis the sorting-office
situation and have had similar experiences myself. I used to be very critical
of them but my attitude changed when I realized what they are up against.
Julia takes me to task: >Royal Mail and Post Office Ltd are two different things, so comparison >between Royal Mail and the US postal delivery service is completely >misleading. Hmm, I think not - As far as I'm aware, Post Office Ltd is still a wholly owned subsidiary of Royal Mail Group Ltd so your claim that they are "two different things" is mere sophistry. US Postal Service and Royal Mail (including Post office Ltd) are still comparable in many ways - except that, in the UK, HM Gov has removed the postal monopoly. If the US can achieve an impressive delivery standard across a huge country for a mere 22pence, why can't we? I guess it needs a lot of political will and capital investment. According to a report on the BBC this morning; >The liberalisation of the UK postal service has produced "no significant >benefits" for both households and small businesses. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/7385044.stm There seems to be something of a parallel with the rail closures under Beeching in the 50's and 60's - he closed the unprofitable branch lines to concentrate on the main lines. Of course, without the feeder traffic from the branch lines, many of the main lines then became unprofitable. Close enough local Post Offices and then the network behind it becomes unprofitable as the traffic falls to an unsustainable level... What would encourage me to use Royal Mail more for parcels would be a reliable location in central Headington to collect them. Ideally, the postie wouldn't even bother to try and deliver any package larger than my letterbox, instead, just a card through the door - that would make their job easier and far more time efficient and, hopefully, reduce the chances of loss. Obviously, different households should be able to opt for a different delivery strategy. Of course, we *used* to have such a place at the top of Lime Walk... Unfortunately, the 'pay 50p and collect from local post office' service doesn't seem to work too well, each time I've tried it, several weeks have elapsed before I get my parcel - by cycling down to Littlemore to collect it.
If Headington Post Office is worth saving, we must all try to use it more. It would be good to have it as the primary parcels collection point for Headington, but it might need more parking spaces. (It is so tempting to use MailBoxes for sending mail, however, as the service is so much better and it has longer opening hours. Do Post Office counters deserve to survive, especially now they have upped their fee for paying people's bills?) The local Post Office closures (outside Headington and Marston) are all going to go ahead, so it is now fruitless to continue that debate: http://www.oxfordmail.net/display.var.2248985.0.post_office_closures_finalised.php
Post Office Ltd does not deliver letters or decide the price of a stamp. It
runs Post Offices, and if as Jock and Dermot say, the closure of Post Offices
is the result of a "liberal" policy which is such a good thing, how come the
Libdems and various other parties all loudly blamed the Labour government for
the closures, deploring them as a crime?
Before you praise the low cost of a stamp in America maybe you should ask
whether you would like to live on the wage of a US postman/woman.
Now you're making my case for me Julia. My point was that PO
Counters Ltd has nothing whatever to do with the EU directives on
competition in the transport and delivery of mail.
If it were freed up itself from its link with the transportation and
delivery department, Royal Mail, it could have been able to innovate
to replace business lost through government and government agency
changes to the way they operated and even to capitalize on the
potential new business from competitors to Royal Mail in the delivery
system.
If people think collecting undelivered mail from Littlemore is
inconvenient, you ought to try when it's ParcelForce or many of the
other courier firms who seem to have depots in the next county, or
Witney or somewhere.
I am sure those firms would have jumped at the chance to use a
network of postal offices where they could leave parcels for
collection and signature much closer to the addressee.
Once again, I'm afraid that Julia willfully misrepresents me: I have not said
that I think Post Office closures are a good thing (just the reverse, in fact),
neither have I suggested that it is in any way "liberal".
Yes, Post Office Ltd does not deliver letters or decide the price of a stamp -
it is, however, a wholly-owned subsidiary of Royal Mail Group Ltd, who *do*
have the power to do such things.
Yes, I agree that it is a bit simplistic to compare directly postal charges
from another country to here and I take your point about wages; in the US,
fulltime permanent posties earn between $35k to $55K per year (though
introductory, probationary and part time rates are lower) - which is not bad,
bearing in mind that federal government health, insurance and pension benefits
are also included.
This compares reasonably well to the £300(?) or so weekly basic pay in the UK.
A couple of friends of mine have been posties in the US for several years at a
time and, given the lower (generally) cost of living in the US, lived
reasonably comfortably.
Returning to Headington; like Stephanie, I too considered Mailboxes, but it is
quite expensive (£336 per year) and I would rather support the Royal Mail/Post
Office if only they were permitted to provide a good service.
Looking on GoogleEarth just now, I see that parking is certainly very limited
behind the Post Office. Who(Co-Op?)owns the larger car park behind the
restaurants adjacent to the PO?
It looks as if pedestrian access could be made from the PO car park to the
bigger one, given sufficient good will. That might enable a local parcel pickup
point.
I don't think frequent customer access crossing the pavement from London Road
to drive down beside the PO would work very well.
Sorry, I wasn't suggesting that people should rent a mailbox address
in Mailboxes (although it would solve the parcel problem).
Anyone can come in off the street and send letters and parcels from
Mailboxes at the same price as from the Post Office without paying any
yearly fee. The only difference is that the service is much better,
and there is no queue. (But don't go to Mailboxes on a Saturday
morning, as their Saturday mail is not picked up until Monday.)
Mailboxes was cited as the main reason that the post office in
Summertown closed. But should people feel guilty for choosing what
they think is a better service?
As far as I know, the car park behind the restaurants is owned by the pet shop.
I'm sorry if anyone thinks I'm "willfully misrepresenting" what they said - of course I have no such intention. My last word on the subject: if you go and read this report http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/7385044.stm it says that an independent enquiry has just concluded that the "liberalisation" of our postal has services has not, on the whole, benefitted the majority of people or achieved anything. But the term "liberalisation" is a very dubious one - what is protectionism and what is free competition in the context of the EU which exists to create a protected trading environment within itself? (That's why we were originally panicked into joining it). That is what I mean about the old left/right liberal/protectionist labels not really making any sense any more.
The car park behind the restaurants and opposite the Co-op is Co-op owned, or at least run. A person patrols in normal shopping hours, and makes sure you're shopping at the Co-op, though they will allow you to go to other shops too. Didn't Royal Mail waste an awful lot of money trying to redesignate themselves 'Consignia', which everyone hated, cost loads of money in 'focus groups' and change of livery, and lasted about five minutes, not to mention opening RM to raucous ridicule? PG ----- Original Message ----- From: Stephanie Jenkins To: Headington & Marston Neighbourhood Forum Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2008 3:03 PM Subject: Re: [HMNF] Further erosion of postal service Sorry, I wasn't suggesting that people should rent a mailbox address in Mailboxes (although it would solve the parcel problem). Anyone can come in off the street and send letters and parcels from Mailboxes at the same price as from the Post Office without paying any yearly fee. The only difference is that the service is much better, and there is no queue. (But don't go to Mailboxes on a Saturday morning, as their Saturday mail is not picked up until Monday.) Mailboxes was cited as the main reason that the post office in Summertown closed. But should people feel guilty for choosing what they think is a better service? As far as I know, the car park behind the restaurants is owned by the pet shop. Stephanie Jenkins Headington, Oxford Info about Stephanie Jenkins: http://forums.e-democracy.org/p/stephaniejenkins This topic's messages may be viewed at: http://forums.e-democracy.org/r/topic/89zB1ZyfxRgGH0TUuTNXo ----------------------------------------- To post, send your message to: <email obscured> To leave or for daily digest, type "unsubscribe" or "digest on," in subject line and send to: <email obscured> More info about Headington & Marston Neighbourhood Forum: http://forums.e-democracy.org/groups/oxford-hm E-Democracy.Org rules: http://e-democracy.org/rules ----------------------------------------- Technical assistance thanks to our friends at http://OnlineGroups.Net
I think it was a big mistake to sell the Headington Post Office building some
years ago to the man who started up the plastic items shop in part of it. I
gather he still owns the whole building, and leases it out to both the Post
Office and the present plastics shop owner.
We would all be in trouble now if we had sold our houses at the same time, but
remained in them paying rent.
As for the car-park, it may well be that the Co-op owns it now: I could be out
of date. I will try to find out.
I checked with the car park attendant today when I was up there and he confirmed that the Co-op owns the car park. Did they really sell the Post Office building? That seems incredible. Silver. Family. Off. Selling. The. PG ----- Original Message ----- From: Stephanie Jenkins To: Headington & Marston Neighbourhood Forum Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2008 7:54 AM Subject: Re: [HMNF] Further erosion of postal service I think it was a big mistake to sell the Headington Post Office building some years ago to the man who started up the plastic items shop in part of it. I gather he still owns the whole building, and leases it out to both the Post Office and the present plastics shop owner. We would all be in trouble now if we had sold our houses at the same time, but remained in them paying rent. As for the car-park, it may well be that the Co-op owns it now: I could be out of date. I will try to find out. Stephanie Jenkins Headington, Oxford Info about Stephanie Jenkins: http://forums.e-democracy.org/p/stephaniejenkins This topic's messages may be viewed at: http://forums.e-democracy.org/r/topic/Y89j7KFIbTHuX7eAxJTda ----------------------------------------- To post, send your message to: <email obscured> To leave or for daily digest, type "unsubscribe" or "digest on," in subject line and send to: <email obscured> More info about Headington & Marston Neighbourhood Forum: http://forums.e-democracy.org/groups/oxford-hm E-Democracy.Org rules: http://e-democracy.org/rules ----------------------------------------- Technical assistance thanks to our friends at http://OnlineGroups.Net
Too late to affect the local Post Office closures, but Postcomm is proposing a split between Royal Mail and Post Office Ltd and part privatisation of RM only: *** Postcomm is proposing that Post Offices Ltd, which controls the huge network of post offices, should be separated from Royal Mail and kept wholly in public ownership, because it already receives a substantial subsidy and is viewed as a de facto social service. *** http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/robertpeston/2008/05/semiprivate_royal_mail.html If the PO is recognised as a 'de facto social service', one has to wonder why so many have been shut down (saving money is the obvious answer, I suppose...)? If this split were to happen, I wonder if it would be good news or bad for post offices? I've used Headington PO quite a few times recently, prompt service and no queues - don't know if trade in general is down or just that many pensioners now get their money other than by collection at a PO, thus reducing the overall traffic?
It is confirmed in today's Oxford Mail that the Oxford Mail Centre in Cowley will close, and that by the middle of next year Oxford's mail will be sorted in Swindon: http://www.oxfordmail.net/display.var.2278137.0.royal_mail_sorting_will_move.php This surely strengthens the argument that we should be able to collect our parcels/sign for letters at Headington Post Office? Does anyone know what the Royal Mail is proposing vis-a-vis collection of undelivered mail? [Irrelevant P.S: Don't forget that six Headington gardens are open for charity tomorrow (Sunday)]
I don't think the closure of Oxford Mail Centre will make any difference to
delivery or parcel collection - as far as I can see the East Oxford Delivery
office in Sandy Lane will remain operating just as before, it's just the Mail
Centre on the corner of Hollow Way/Garsington Road that'll close.
The Royal Mail is claiming that the extra time taken to transport post from
Oxford to Swindon will be more than counterbalanced by the improved sorting
technology at the new Swindon mail centre (and, to read between the lines, they
seem to be hoping that their Swindon workforce won't go on strike quite so
often).
Dermot asks "If the PO is recognised as a 'de facto social service', one has to
wonder why
so many have been shut down (saving money is the obvious answer, I
suppose...)?" The answer is plain: because our Government spending is
controlled by the EU, which limits what we can spend on post offices and other
services here, while siphoning off huge amounts of our taxes to the other
member states. Our money is taken to pay for museums of local culture in Bilbao
or offices with luxury bathrooms for MEPS. Or their "fact-finding" trips to
Malta and Cyprus!
Of course we have been selling off the family silver, as Pippa says - wake up,
we've been doing that for twenty years or more. This country is in long-term
decline.
Rather longer than that Julia. Ever since Thatcher got in in 1979. PG ----- Original Message ----- From: Julia Gasper To: Headington & Marston Neighbourhood Forum Sent: Saturday, May 17, 2008 10:34 AM Subject: Re: [HMNF] Further erosion of postal service Dermot asks "If the PO is recognised as a 'de facto social service', one has to wonder why so many have been shut down (saving money is the obvious answer, I suppose...)?" The answer is plain: because our Government spending is controlled by the EU, which limits what we can spend on post offices and other services here, while siphoning off huge amounts of our taxes to the other member states. Our money is taken to pay for museums of local culture in Bilbao or offices with luxury bathrooms for MEPS. Or their "fact-finding" trips to Malta and Cyprus! Of course we have been selling off the family silver, as Pippa says - wake up, we've been doing that for twenty years or more. This country is in long-term decline. Julia Gasper Headington Quarry, Oxford England Info about Julia Gasper: http://forums.e-democracy.org/p/juliagasper This topic's messages may be viewed at: http://forums.e-democracy.org/r/topic/BS3SuMuaRamB8ogjgBGCf ----------------------------------------- To post, send your message to: <email obscured> To leave or for daily digest, type "unsubscribe" or "digest on," in subject line and send to: <email obscured> More info about Headington & Marston Neighbourhood Forum: http://forums.e-democracy.org/groups/oxford-hm E-Democracy.Org rules: http://e-democracy.org/rules ----------------------------------------- Technical assistance thanks to our friends at http://OnlineGroups.Net
An article in yesterday's Guardian said that more PO closures are on the way.
So Headington, look out!
Of course we're not the only EU country which is having to cut back its budget
for essentials services here.
France is cutting 8,000 teaching jobs because of EU curbs on spending:-
"The main issue in Thursday's protests was a plan to shed 11,200 jobs in
education, including over 8,000 teaching posts, by not replacing one out of two
retiring employees.
The government says the job cuts are necessary to rein in public spending and
balance the budget by 2012, in line with a French commitment to the European
Union.
An OpinionWay poll found 54 percent of respondents felt the strike was
justified."
The money is going on bribes to the new EU countries to entice them to join. So
the EU gets bigger and more powerful. At our expense. If you think this is bad,
just wait until they invite Turkey in, and give it billions of our money.
We won't just be selling off the family silver then, we'll be selling off the
roof over our heads.
On Friday morning Parcel Force tried to deliver a parcel to me when I was out
(at the Farmers' Market, buying asparagus!...) As I was not there to sign for
it, they took it away. They are not going to return with it until Tuesday
morning, after the Bank Holiday.
Later the same day, Royal Mail turned up with some other items. I was in, and
took delivery. (Anyway I have an arrangement with them to leave mail with a
neighbour if I;m not in.)
This leads me to reflect that the system of so-called "open competition" and
"liberalisation" means that three vans have to come to my door to deliver
parcels that could have been sent via Royal Mail, in a single delivery. If so,
I would have got the parcel, which happens to be urgent, four days earlier.
Would the defenders of so-called "open competition" and "liberalisation" like
to explain how that is that good for
i) the problem of traffic overload on our roads,
ii) world shortage of petrol,
iii) pollution, carbon-emissions and global warming?
Would it not be better to spend the money that is now spent on extra petrol,
instead to subsidize Post Offices - of which 3,000 more (after the present
lot) are doomed to closure?
For the past couple of weeks we have been receiving other people's mail and our
mail has been delivered elsewhere. We have notified Royal Mail and they are
investigating.
I wonder whether anyone else in the Bateman Street - Kennet Street - Gardener
street area has also been experiencing this?
We have been suffering this problem ever since moving into the Quarry area two years ago. It would not be an exaggeration to claim that at least a dozen letters are wrongly posted through our door each month. Heaven knows who is getting our post! We have never bothered to confront our postman, or to lodge an official complaint, as we are convinced that doing so would lead to more of our mail going missing. It's not down to temporary staff either, as I've watched out regular postie do it on several occasions. What can you do? I'm absolutely sure that complaining will be counter-productive. Mick Victor Sperber wrote: > For the past couple of weeks we have been receiving other people's mail and our mail has been delivered elsewhere. We have notified Royal Mail and they are investigating. > > I wonder whether anyone else in the Bateman Street - Kennet Street - Gardener street area has also been experiencing this? > > > Victor Sperber > > Info about Victor Sperber: http://forums.e-democracy.org/p/victorsperber > > This topic's messages may be viewed at: http://forums.e-democracy.org/r/topic/7qLJOQ12TIy8vWT8fSOZ1J
Sadly a problem for us too; we have a fairly regular flow of post arriving at
our house, but which should be delivered to the same numbered house in the next
street.
It then falls to us to put it back in a post box, or walk it 'round to them (as
there's little chance of contact with the postman as the post never comes
before we've gone to work).
Can I reassure residents in the Headington area that some posties are
exceptional?
I would like to sing the praises of our local postman! Indeed some
mornings one can hear him coming - singing an Italian opera piece! He
has a wonderful voice and we rarely get misdirected post, although
sometimes I wish my postbag was not quite so heavy with council papers
and leaflets!!
Cllr Roz Smith
Barton & Churchill Division
12 Weyland Road
Tel. 01865 750 731
Mob. 07722 840 117
Liberal Democrats - Putting People First