Post in Reforming liquor laws to combat crime

May 22 21:05 UTC

Thanks Paula, although it's interesting how marijuana keeps getting
pulled into this discussion, or did i miss some correspondence in the
beginning.

Thought we should keep it going in case we stumble upon a solution:)

I know Brendon that Alcohol causes more problems than ghanja but I
don't think either of them should be made more illegal.

I like the point that Holland - probably much of Europe - teaches kids
to drink properly (?) less binge culture perhaps, so how could this be
achieved here? Free  and available breathalising? Teaching them to tell
when they should stop drinking? More booze free places like the old
days- swimming pools, theatre, fairs for low cost?

My 13 year old  says things to me like  "the world is  ****ed" and I
worry about all the pain and sadness young people feel these days. If
they are not popular and successful at either sport or academics, what
are we giving them? Can anyone below middle class afford to go on a
holiday if they don't have access to a bach these days? They don't have
dances and other community socials like in days of old - our society
seems to be gradually getting worse while they see that overseas things
are really hitting the skids and maybe they expect that level of loss
of human rights and environmental disaster to happen over here
eventually.

It seems to me that unfortunately young people have soooo many issues,
and whether or not they get drunk and they or someone else  is injured
is very low on their radar of priorities. Contrast this to our average
60 
year old view in ChCh, Property Damage and Boy Racing is wayyyyyyyy up
their
priority list.  Total conflict of interests.

What do others think, is putting the feelings of these kids first more
important than keeping them away from omnipresent dangers like drugs
and alcohol, and will this inadvertently fix many problems at once.

Kerry McKenna

Paula Lambert wrote:

*
Kevin made a point.
Kerry has hit the nerve nicely too.
The double standards surrounding the planet and the plant . . .  and the
respect that most adults absolutely demand from young people, while all
these double standards fly around . . .  and I'm sure there are probably one
or two other issues young people would mention if given the chance.

We treat them as though they are stupid, when all they are is naive.  A lot
of us (parents)  are full of fear or crap, while they are merely full of
idealism.     Alcohol widely available is easy to blame, but its time for
the mirror folks.   The blanket approach of  'Do as I say, not as I do'
just may not cut it any more.   I will try to get to the public meeting but
expect to be shouted down.   The ignorance and blind prejudice that
surrounds this issue is appalling.

Last year at the Chch venue for the international Million Marijuana March
(230+ cities worldwide on Mayday each year) there were 300+ youngish and
older people sitting in the sun in groups having a great afternoon.  Young
(and quite a few older) people using pot.   Peaceful, friendly, thoughtful .
. .  That night was the Edgeware Road party where two young girls were
killed and many other young people injured.  Young people drinking, no
adults around.    What a huge difference between the two groups.

Cannabis users  are called the most pejorative terms, but the fact remains
double standards that surround alcohol use, including that it is only very
rarely described as a *drug* though that is plainly what it is . . . the
fact that media reports of other drug use are only for scaring people and
selling newspapers . . . that where drugs are involved factual analysis and
rational thought usually disappear down the toilet . . .  Alcohol is a
loss-leader for supermarkets (what lunacy is that ?) . . .   Do we have the
society we deserve  . . .  are our communities all built on hypocrisy ?
Quick, wheres that carpet !  Lift it, shove all these double standards under
it, slam your heel as hard as you can into it to squash it flat.

    Hi team:

alcohol needs to seen in the context of everyday
'other drug' use in NZ, and surrounding attitudes and
problems.

It is really simplistic to try and fix the alcohol
problem without recognising the possiblilty that there
is a bigger thing under the water.

which is what blair was getting at, as the National
drug policy started out attempting to minimise drugs
harms including alchol realates to other social
problems cannabis problem, the tobacco problem, the
methamphetamine problem, and other social problems
where 'non compliance' with good health is normal.

all nzs social problems have 'non-compliance' in
common. not doing what told is institional in NZ. it
is part of our spirit (or at least a massive sub
culture)

That is so often the way of life for many in NZ- part
of our culture is all things in moderation, including
moderation.

I suggest you look at the doublestandards with popular
intoxicant #2, Brendon. And whats the latest update on
Labours cannabis-related health promotion given the
prevalence is something like 14 - 16% (likelihood of
under-reporting noted research team)

Much higher prevalence of course AMONGST YOUNG PEOPLE.

most people i know love alchol to a greater or lesser
extent. Quite a lot also love pot and not in a
detrimental way. So why the double standard? a select
committee in 1998 found double standards to impair
drug-related health promotion.

started to join any dots yet?

regards
Kevin O'Connell